this is an open discussion forum. keep it clean. personal attacks on private citizens will not be tolerated. you may discuss politics if you like but you may not rip or endorse specific local candidates.
Missy Kenderick came to a County Commission meeting and said the plant was restricted in what they burn. She also stated they would receive no local tax breaks.
At the IDA meeting in the public Q and A session , Rollcast Energy principal John Campbell was directly asked if they would sign something restricting what they burn and agree to not take local tax breaks.
He said no, they would not sign anything restricting what they burn or saying they would not take local tax breaks.
Even Kenny Roberts said they would "do whatever it takes" including tax incentives to make it happen.
We are slowly getting closer to the real truth. Getting the truth is like prying diamonds from rock.
Mayor Peter Banks now, as reported by the Herald-Gazette, says Rollcast is restricted by the EPD and would have to ask the EPD for a new burn permit. He also says Barnesville would have to give permission.
The only thing Banks is omitting is the final clause in the MOU he and Kenny signed.
On page 2 of the "Project Brown Memorandum of Understanding" in the middle of the page it says:
The Developer shall control the development of the Site and may change the Preliminary Master Plan from time to time in its SOLE discretion; provided that if Developer is desirous of developing the Site for anything other than a a non-fossil biomass fueled power facility and related improvements, Developer must first receive the written consent of the Officials, such CONSENT NOT TO BE UNREASONABLY CONDITIONED, WITHHELD or DELAYED."
What this means is Barnesville and the IDA signed an agreement that in common legal jargon says the plant can do anything they want and we cannot restrict or delay any change so long as they ask in advance in writing.
In essence Barnesville and the IDA has agreed to limit the operation to whatever the plant asks for, and whatever the EPD will permit. The EPD permits coal, tires, pressure treated wood, and other things.
What Barnesville and the IDA has done is sign another agreement that can get Lamar County or Barnesville into a long expensive legal battle over what happens in the future. We would have to go to court and argue what "reasonable" means.
If we put aside the fact Missy Kenderick told a "big tall tale" to Citizens and the Commissioners at the Commission meeting, and now focus on the slight increase in integrity by Peter Banks, we see the IDA is moving away from the original position but not quite bringing the issue into full sunlight.
The facts, and they are all in writing, are:
1. They can burn anything the EPD allows if they ask us first. We will not "unreasonably" try to delay or restrict any changes.
2. If 90 days before closing they ask for a 15 year bond lease back financing where the IDA owns (tax free) the land, equipment, and everything else the IDA will give it.
Unlike other deals the IDA has done, this thing will ALWAYS be a power plant. No one is going to spend 160 million dollars and then throw it away. Nearly all of the expense is in the burning, boilers and generating equipment. Very little or anything is usable for anything else.
If the IDA was smart, they would set a local cap on pollution levels and make sure the equipment (since that is most of the value) is taxed.
There is something else driving them to build this thing other than the 20 or so on site jobs it creates. Perhaps a share of that 160 million will filter into a local business, perhaps it is just feeling important.
They are bringing a plant that emits 20% or so less overall emissions than a coal plant into our community with a weak agreement that pretty much lets the plant burn what they want within EPD allowable limits.
The question is in trade for what? It certainly can't be the 20 jobs. If we fired Missy and disbanded the IDA we could create far more than 20 jobs with the savings.
It is fascinating to watch everyone work up in a lather about burning "fossil fuels" at this plant.
Barnesville is only 30 miles from the largest coal fired power plant in the world. Burns 40,000 tons every 24 hours and receives 5-6 trainloads of coal daily. Don't think I have ever smelled anything from Plant Scherer in all the years it has been there.
Oh well, I suppose the young people graduating from Gordon can always get a high paying job at Aldora...
Unlike Plant Scherer, Barnesville is not going to have a 1200 foot smoke stack and 4 cooling towers. Barnesville will not be using water from a clean lake for cooling. It will be using sewage water. Barnesville will not be getting fuel via rail. It will be trucked in via our roads. Perhaps you need to go back to Gordon for higher learning. I suggest potography or boating. It is evident that you don't get the picture and that you have totally missed the boat in regards to our green power plant.
What do you think new fire station at Gordon College on Gordon Rd? Need two or three fire stations for the Barnesville Fire Department. And... ask the fire chief about how many firefighters working 24 hours? Did you ask the mayor about new fire station on Gordon Rd?
"Unlike Plant Scherer, Barnesville is not going to have a 1200 foot smoke stack and 4 cooling towers. Barnesville will not be using water from a clean lake for cooling. It will be using sewage water. Barnesville will not be getting fuel via rail. It will be trucked in via our roads. Perhaps you need to go back to Gordon for higher learning. I suggest potography or boating. It is evident that you don't get the picture and that you have totally missed the boat in regards to our green power plant."
That was my point Mister Wizard.
Burning fossil fuels at the B'ville plant would require all the things you mention. All the hand wringing being done about this facility neatly overlooks the nonexistence of adequate water, and transport to supply this plant for fossil.
Never mind, it is much more fun for these CAVE (Citizens Against Virtually Everything...) dwellers to oppose any attempt to add something here. It's the Barnesville way.
You folks don't know how a power plant works. Plant Scherer has a tall stack because of the volume of fuel it burns, not because it is coal.
It burns trainloads a day, so the stack has to be tall and wide.
This plant is likely only about 20% cleaner overall with wood than it would be with coal for the same 50MW output. The fancy guys from Atlanta are fooling you.
If the plant is really only going to burn clean waste wood and nothing else, they would sign a cap on pollution limits or a specific agreement giving limits on what they will burn.
Right now they refuse to do that, and you can bet if wood gets too expensive (it already costs more than coal) or if they want to make extra money burning waste, they will be able to do anything right up to what the EPD will allow with a new permit. The EPD will permit many things other than wood.
We have eight people led by the nose by two or three people that don't seem to understand what they are agreeing to.
If the plant really is going to be so clean and green forever, they wouldn't have a problem agreeing to a written emissions cap at the limit of what they told us they want to burn.
They are very smart, and they have dazzled a few people with big money and buzz words into an agreement that really doesn't protect us from anything in the future.
Once that thing gets built it will always be something that burns something to produce money. If it costs more to burn the fuel then they can make with sales of electricity, they aren't going to shut it off and go away. They will find something else to burn that somehow puts positive cash into the operation.
If they DON'T intend to burn anything with more emissions than the original clean wood permit, they certainly could put it in writing. If they did that and paid a reasonable local tax almost everyone would be happy.
As it is right now they promise to love, honor, and obey but they won't sign a good pre-nup. If they want to change their minds a day later or ten years later, we will be stuck with whatever the EPD allows.
It would be such a very simple thing to say "we agree to cap the emission limits at the intial permit limits for a no-tire fresh wood only plant" if that is what they really always intend.
Only a fool without any care for our future would sign a MOU like Kenny Roberts and Mayor banks did.
Look at the great wisdom Barnesville displayed on the new housing project, and the way the IDA misrepresented this project at the County Commission meeting.
Why should everyone trust them now, when the eventual cost might be another big expensive lawsuit we can't win?
An honorable man would never have any problem puting down in writing what he is promising verbally. And if the IDA was so honest, they never would have had a representative tell a big tall tale at the commission meeting.
I agree that a nerve must have been hit, all this talk about an ass whooping- somebody is mad about 8:54's comment, which tells most of us that it hit dead on target.
hardwick has served his time in the county commision. he is all done working so hard for people who didnt appreciate him. let him enjoy his well deserved retirement. if he wants something on the side just to stay busy maybe someone has a opening he will fit into. heis a hard worker that can handle many positions but not the sheriff. please not that.
I don't know Ms Thrash. I hope she does a good job. But despite that, I can't help but feel Lamar County lost a sure good thing with Gene. He put in alot of hours working for the betterment of Lamar County and simultaneously put up with the like's of the Rauch's and McCall's. I know they feel vindicated but these two in all their name calling and public grandstanding have cost the people of Lamar County another good servant. So gmac and rauch congratulations on running off another good person for your the sake of stroking your own egos. I know you two must be proud.
Mr. Morgan, For you to think that Tom or I were responsible for Commissioner Hardwick's loss is foolish. For starters we have no control over the voters. Next, all our voiced concerns were based on facts and not fiction. And finally, Commissioner Hardwick done this to himself. Actions on the BOC and IDA is what cost him the election.
Of course this is my opinion. And, my ego is not in any need of being stroked.
sounds like it must be the fault of everyone but the guy who got his butt kicked by a woman. course wdm is so smart he knows different.
instead of blaming others i'd be asking who is next or why did a he lose to someone he kept saying was worthless. if hardwick was right and thrash was worthless as he kept saying in his negative campaign then what does it make him to lose to such a worthless person? less than here, doesnt it?
I think he would have won if he wasnt so negative or full of himself.
One thing is for sure gmac you can definitely call out a sore loser since you appear to be one yourself. You have libeled and slandered this man's name for the past year on this blog anytime you got a chance. Just remember, you reap what you sow.
And gmac, even by your standards, I didn't think you were so weak you would have to validate your marked entry with a couple of anonymous blogs. That should tell everyone alot about you.
don't worry about wdm gary. he's just hurting right now because his buddy got beat fair and square. he's a sore loser like the other old boys who thought they had a lifetime job but lost. anyone can see how childish and spoiled he is.
Ad hominem attacks against others or me really just show how little you have to support Mr. Hardwick.
Mr. Hardwick lost by about a 20% margin. You may not like that, but this is America at its best. It is our system at work.
I didn't vote for or against Hardwick or Thrash, they were not in my district. I had no say in the matter.
Thrash didn't beat him, McCall didn't beat him, and I certainly didn't beat him.
The only way a long term elected offical is if most people who vote think the other candidate is a better choice.
Move on with your life and enjoy being a normal citizen with one vote. Stop blaming others for Gene's political shortfalls.
Next election, get your lazy rear off your golf cart and work for the person you support. Don't come around when it is too late with big teary eyes blaming others for your electile disfunction.
Mr Rauch, you are a jackass and no matter who the county commissioners are that will never change. You don't know all you think you know. You defiled a good public servant without merit and it will all come back to haunt you someday (I know this for a fact.) I just hope that day is sooner rather than later.
speak your truth quietly, and listen to others, even the dull and ignorant,,,,,they too have their stories......and if you dont like their stories, they have others that you might like
right wingers who clamor for wars, and the death pently; and who oppose universal health care are not "pro-life" and should not say that they are for pro life
Are you any kin to Buzzy Morgan, the well-driller who asked for and got a special variance which relieved him of the responsibility of having to run county water into his subdivision under construction on Steele Road?
Hardwick was one of the ringleaders in that fiasco which was approved in a secret meeting of the BOC in October 2005. Even commissioner Brown said on the record that the meeting hadnt been advertised and was the wrong thing to do.
If someone did that for me I'd sure like them too. That must have saved that person with your last name tens of thousands of dollars.
It didnt help anyone else though. Everyone else still has to pay to install water if their developments are within a certain distance of the available water.
Buzzy and Gene also helped out your (i mean his) sister when she got in a jam over a breached conservation property.
His sister was developing and selling lots in Milner on land that had been in conservation.
The BOA later found that since her husband had passed away she had received the benefit in error.
Im not for sure but it looks like the BOA let her slide on the underpayments since it was their 'mistake.'
Are you kni to these folks? NOT saying they've done ANYTHING wrong or otherwise; but if the commissioners helped me out like this when everyone else is struggling to pay their share of the load, well Id love them too.
I am not in the subdivision business so I can't answer your accusations. I don't know anything about conservation because I have never owned that much raw land. I do know that Tom Rauch and Gary McCall are two idiots who think they know alot more than they really do. But of course, I am sure alot of other people realize this as well.
5:38 or Roach or McCall, I do know for a fact that Buzzy Morgan had absolutely nothing to do with the Steele Road subdivision. Go look at the plat that was submitted to the planning and zoning office and you will find out for yourself. The fact is wdm appears to be right about one thing -- you don't know as much as you think you do. Just to show you how weak this Tom Roach and McCall are they are online beating up on an 80 year old woman because that is how old Buzzy's sister is. It takes a real macho man to do that.
9:06 are you clueless. Roach and McCall are accusing Mr. Morgan of getting the county to run water lines to his subdivision (which turns out not to be his) for free...now if he was going to make money drilling wells, why would he have the county run the water??? It should just show us that Tom Roach and Gary McCall are stirring up stink on good local people like they did Hardwick. Roach and McCall are a cancer.
How do you know who WDM is? What if he is not who you think he is?
Blogs can be a good thing, but they can be a bad thing too. They can be a good tool to debate facts. That all falls apart when people start getting personal. Then a blog is useless.
Let me give you an example. There isn't a single place on here where I said anything about WDM or his family. I said:
1.) Missy Kenderick misrepresented the agreement the IDA signed at the commission meeting. I can prove that.
2.) Mayor Banks is not telling the full story. He is moving closer to the truth now, but still omitting key facts. I can prove that.
Hardwick got dragged into this by someone, and then the whole issue diverged from the power plant. We all know the reason ANY politician loses is because the majority of voters just don't want the guy as much as they do someone running against him. End of discussion on Hardwick. He lost. It's over. Bye-bye.
A few people steered this away from the real issue, which is the power plant and the fact the IDA, after an initial public lie, is still telling people a partial story.
Arguing with WDM is exactly what they need. Everything said in personal attacks makes everyone else look bad, and takes attention away from the IDA's bad agreement.
The entire community could get stuck with a giant multi-million dollar lawsuit if they sign a weak agreement. We should focus on what is important and what we know as facts, not some past commissoner and his odd deals with friends. That chapter was closed by an election.
Let's focus on important things like getting the IDA to say they unequivocally support the community, rather than the power plant. It is the COMMUNITY Banks should be supporting, not the power plant.
someone should try to defend the power plant instead of going after rauch and gmca.....bad mouthing people dont help prove your point..question is; do the majority of the people believe this is a good idea.....and the second question is do we trust the ida to make the important decisions that will effect this county for years.......if not, we need to bring pressure to change the makeup of the ida......need to have public information meetings to air our concerns and get the facts.....at a convience place and time and independent of the ida or commisioners
How is it that everyone else involved with the power plant is wrong and Tom is right? According to this one man, the mayor of B'vile is a liar, the IDA are liars, the county commission are liars? Has Mr. Rauch every thought that maybe he is wrong? Oh, wait a minute, there is no way he could be wrong...he thinks he is God.
Here is a fact for you to debate Mr. Roach, or can I just call you Papa Roach. The Mayor of B'ville says you are misrepresenting information? The IDA called out for misrepresenting information? Could it be that you are mispresenting information or are you calling all these people liars?
Tom Rauch I trust Mayor Banks on his record from the past. He is a solid as man as you will find in your life. His exact words are "unequivocal support" for the power plant and that the confusion is being created by the 'misinformation from a few." Do you think he meant you when he said a few?
I'll add sound recordings of Kenny Roberts and the fellow from the power plant, John Campbell, tonight.
The agreement Kenny Roberts and Peter banks signed contains a clause that clearly states the power plant can change what they burn or what they do any time they want. It says they have to get permission, but in Exhibit A it also says Barnesville and the IDA will not unreasonably condition, withold, or delay anything they ask for.
They can say what they like, but there is NOTHING in the agreement that restricts or limits what they burn and the power plant knows it.
The IDA also misled the public about incentives. Missy Kenderick stood in front of the County Commission and told the commission there would be no tax abatement. The document they signed includes an undefined open ended tax abatement of 15 years.
When I asked John Campbell, the plant principle at the IDA meeting, point blank if they would sign an agreement limiting what the plant can burn he said "I don't think that is necessary". I said "so the answer is no, you won't sign something limiting what you burn", and he indictated they would not sign anything.
When it came to abatements both Campbell and Roberts said if the plant required abatements they would get them. Kenny said he would do "whatever it takes" in the line of abatements to get the plant in here.
That's all on tape. It's all public record.
When I had a direct discussion with Campbell after the meeting, he said they might entertain some sort of pollution cap. He felt however that whatever the EDP limit was for emissions would be enough.
The "clean plant" they visited in Michigan is in an area with an "F" air quality rating. Yet the spin we hear is how clean the air was.
This entire project is a good example of how the IDA spins things to mislead the public. They are working for the plant, not for the community.
Another example of how the IDA spins things is the claim seven businesses announced their intention to locate and do business in Lamar. One of the businesses, Southern Textiles, never intended to hire anyone from lamar. They are leasing a storage and dock space at Carters for finished goods from China. The goods from China actually reduce jobs in the Forsyth area, and do not create any jobs here.
Another company already closed and left.
The track record of the IDA is actually not very good. The spin however, is excellent.
You'll notice they cannot refute anything I say. They can only attack the messanger. This is because they cannot argue against the truth.
Watch carefully. They can't argue against the facts, so they go after the messenger.
why dont we have the company president come to lamar county and meet the people and then we can ask him in person if he will ever burn other stuff......if he says he will burn other stuff, then we will mount an attack to keep him out.....if he says he wont burn other stuff, then does it anyway in the future.....we will take legal action
MR. ROACH IS ONLY TELLING HALF THE STORY HERE AS USUAL. WHAT HE ISN'T TELLING YOU IS THAT THE EPA SETS THE LIMIT TO WHAT CAN BE BURNED THROUGH ITS LICENSING AND THAT THE EPA'S POWER IN THIS SUPERCEDES ANY THING SIGNED OR AGREED UPON BY THE LOCAL ENTITIES INVOLVED. SO YES, IN THEORY HE MAY BE CORRECT THAT THE LOCAL AUTHORITIES CANNOT LIMIT WHAT THEY CAN BURN BECAUSE THAT IS HANDLED BY THE EPA ANYWAY. SO BASICALLY, IF THE LOCALS AND THE COMPANY SIGNED AN AGREEMENT LIMITING WHAT THEY CAN OR CANNOT BURN, IF THE DAY COMES THEY DID WANT TO CHANGE THAT, THE EPA WOULD MAKE THE FINAL DECISIONS ANYWAY NO MATTER WHAT WAS SIGNED NOW BETWEEN THE LOCALS AND THE COMPANY. SO BASICALLY, MR. ROACH IS STIRRING UP A HORNETS NEST WHEN IT IS THE EPA WHO ULTIMATELY DETERMINES WHAT WILL BE BURNED AT THE PLANT AND RIGHT NOW, THE PLANT IS LICENSED BY THE EPA TO BURNED WOOD WASTE PRODUCTS ONLY AND FOR THAT TO BE CHANGED, IT WOULD REQUIRE THE EPA TO AGREE. NOW, MR. ROACH, WOULD YOU PLEASE SHUT UP AND GO BACK IN THAT DARK CREVICE YOU CAME FROM.
If what the person with capital locks says is correct it looks like we are screwed if the plant comes in. If he is right then once the IDA invites them in and Bville signs a sales agreement, we are screwed. They can do anything they want that the EDP allows and we are stuck with it.
Why the hell would they invite in something like that, and why would they tell us they have limits if there aren't any?
It looks like the capitol lock post means that Rauch is really right and we have been hoodwinked by the IDA.
This project would, in my anonymous opinion, be a huge step backward for our community.
It's taken 200 years to get to where we are today. Why do we have to let a few egotistical people satisfy their desires for prestige by whoring out our environment and health?
I'll bet once the money's gone they will be too. Perhaps to St Simons.
MAYBE MR ROACH WOULD BE BETTER SERVED BY BRINGING ALL OF THESE ISSUES BEFORE THE TWO GOVERNING BODIES ULTIMATELY RESPONSIBLE FOR THESE SHENANIGHANS. THE CITY OF BARNESVILLE COUNCIL AND THE LAMAR COMMISSION. THATS WHO APPOINTS THESE FOLKS AND ENABLES THIS TYPE OF THING TO HAPPEN
In preparation for the Olympics, China has announced a factory shutdown for 9 weeks to clear smog and improve air quality in a 200 kilometer radius of Beijing. The shutdown begins July 17th and will extend until September 20th. Beijing, Tianjin, Hebei, Shanxi, Inner Mongolia and Shandong provinces are affected by the shutdown.
If air quality does not improve before the start of the Olympics, there may be an expansion of the shutdown. There are concerns there could also be a bottleneck at two main ports.
The things about the power plant talked about by Tom Rauch are correct. The problem lies with the people that he is trying to communicate with. He raises good questions and he can in fact back up what he is saying with facts. Many people just want to disagree for reasons of disagreeing regardless of the facts. He has been to local meeting and voiced his complaint 12:47 PM. The answers are never direct. They are talk around answers or better known as dancing around the questions. He has already stated he is not against this plant but so many of you refused to hear that part. And 9:06 AM, he doesn't think he is God. He is someone that cares about the community he lives in, wanting honest representation. People should listen to what is being said rather than just hearing what is said. Then form educated opinions about the subject.
so far the only person i've seen that refutes rauch is a guy who made it look even worse for the people. he said we have no control at all over what they do. no one seems to be able to say anything but call names so i reckon rauch must be dead on or it is even worse than he thinks. what gives two or three people the right to stick us with something like this.
Tom I noticed you said the community could get stuck with a multi-million dollar lawsuit. Does that mean you are going to sue the county or the city? And if it does, I sure hope you do a better job with your lawsuit than your cohort gmac did with his.
I hope you do a much better job than I did because, I failed. I also hope that you will be supported by the people of the county in those efforts. Nothing will lead to failure quicker than a community that don't care one way or the other.
Tom, If it was you - that ask how do I know @ 11:52.
We had a conversation last year about a subject and he told me who he was. In fact he gave me his whole name. I used a last name out of respect but I always knew who I'm talking with.
All the comments that followed were not by me. They were made by some of the blog idiots attempting to stir the pot. I pay them no attention. As far as wdm - he doesn't seem to try and hide his identity because I have always known him to post with his screen initials. We just don't agree on anything apparently.
As for the power plant - I understand your point and agree with you. Unfortunately, most people only look at it as a resistance to change. Once a group sacrifices trust and integrity, it's hard to get it back.
“The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out… without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” - H L Mencken
WDM might indeed be who you say. He's just a little unimportant side show. Anyone with any brains can read back and see that.
The real issue is how eight people on the IDA plus the IDA Director were not able to look at this and understand the facts, or why they intentionally misrepresented the facts.
Another issue is why the Barnesville City Council didn't read the papers before voting.
Missy Kenderick stood in front of the County Commision and misrepresented the agreement they signed. That's all public record.
The Mayor of Barnesville discussed the sales agreement in a closed meeting, which is against sunshine laws. Those meetings are supposed to be public (purchases can be closed, sales cannot) so people affected by the changes can be involved in the process.
The only enforcement we will have is the EPD, and the EPD already told the Rock Quarry opponents they don't have the funds to monitor the air down here.
Why would people bring a power plant here that can only make money by burning things, that is not locally owned (so the profit and most of the investment money recycle leaves the area), that only creates 20-25 jobs, and that the only way we can control is with a big legal fight?
What person in his right mind brings a business like that, a business we can never make leave, into a community without telling the community the truth up front?
That plant is a for-profit business with NO local community ties. If that plant finds a cheaper fuel we are not allowed to UNREASONABLY stop or delay them from using it, no matter what it is. Eight people on the IDA plus a Director that can go somewhere else to work, and a few people on the City Council and a Mayor that moved here from some fancy place out east just to be the mayor won't pay the bills for laywers when this plant finds out it is more profitable to burn something else.
We will be stuck with a worthless agreement. The people we trusted will be long gone.
Why would they mislead the public? If the truth is good for us, why not tell it from the start? Those are the real questions that need answered.
Tom no offense but you are beating a dead horse with your silly antics. Your main supporter is gmac, a known pot stirrer & rebel rouser, and a couple of anonymous bloggers (who are probably gmac too.) Every local group's leader has gone on public record saying you are misrepresenting information. The only thing the general publlic knows about you is that you love to claim the local officials are doing them wrong (also known as rebel rousing.) You are like a school kid who isn't getting his way throwing a temper tantrum.
Kinda like the same thing Papa Roach does to the IDA, the mayor, and the commissioners. Roach can't be anyone of importance so he berates those who are. I love wdm's style. Give'em hell.
wdm, with that comment you made at 10:04 AM, you must have been looking in a mirror at the same time. You described yourself to a tee. I have the opinion that you can't stand that someone else is right and you are wrong. You lose control and find fault with an individual. You live to disagree. Apparently you must think it sets you over and above those with whom you disagree. It doesn't. It only shows your inability to communicate and reason. If you had the ability to engage your brain the way you engage your mouth, you could solve all Lamar County problems along with the energy crisis. I can only assume that you are only capable of disagreeing for the sake of capturing the attention of people like yourself. If it offends you that some people actually care for the community they live in, why don't you get off your butt and brainstorm some new ideas yourself? Rather then argue with people with facts, why don’t you gather and use facts to counter your argument. Do you see how simpleminded your character assassinations appear? I don’t know why I even go to lengths to speak with you. With your uneducated attacks on people and subjects that should concern all the people of the county, you just aren't worth my time.
gmac, if you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen. You started the character assasinations on this blog over a year ago. Unless you come to the table with some real evidence, and not just your own personal interpretation, I will continue to assasinate your character like you and Tom have done to so many others. I find great humor in the fact you are trying to act like a victim now when you were the one who first started victimizing local people on this site. Remember the golden rule, do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
Just to keep the record straight, I've never said a word about the County Commission. You won't find a single negative comment here or anywhere else made by me about the Commission.
My beef with the IDA is their representative lied to or misled the commission, whatever word you care to use. That can be proven. She told the Commissioners there was an agreement banning tire and that there would be no local tax abatements, but there never was any binding agreement like that.
The MOU actually says, in writing, the opposite.
1.) It says the plant has control of the site. It says if they want to change fuels or the operation of the plant, they only have to ask in writing. Peter Banks and the IDA agreed to not unreasonably withhold or delay any changes they want to make.
2.) It says if they want a tax abatement with a 15 year term, they only need to ask 90 days before closing and the IDA will do its best to accomplish that.
No one who really honestly cares about our community would bring something into the county that will only for ever and ever be an incinerator that is intended to make a profit for investors by burning things without a clear agreement limiting what they do in the future.
No person looking out for the community would mislead or "spin" the information to make it look like we are protected when we are not.
These are the facts, and they are documented in printed materials and verified by audio recordings.
I'm not the one that made the IDA out to be a liar. The IDA did that to itself. They are an authority that is out of control because they have the wrong people on the authority. No one is watching out for our future.
Just to keep the record straight, I've never said a word about the County Commission. You won't find a single negative comment here or anywhere else made by me about the Commission.
My beef with the IDA is their representative lied to or misled the commission, whatever word you care to use. That can be proven. She told the Commissioners there was an agreement banning tire and that there would be no local tax abatements, but there never was any binding agreement like that.
The MOU actually says, in writing, the opposite.
1.) It says the plant has control of the site. It says if they want to change fuels or the operation of the plant, they only have to ask in writing. Peter Banks and the IDA agreed to not unreasonably withhold or delay any changes they want to make.
2.) It says if they want a tax abatement with a 15 year term, they only need to ask 90 days before closing and the IDA will do its best to accomplish that.
No one who really honestly cares about our community would bring something into the county that will only for ever and ever be an incinerator that is intended to make a profit for investors by burning things without a clear agreement limiting what they do in the future.
No person looking out for the community would mislead or "spin" the information to make it look like we are protected when we are not.
These are the facts, and they are documented in printed materials and verified by audio recordings.
I'm not the one that made the IDA out to be a liar. The IDA did that to itself. They are an authority that is out of control because they have the wrong people on the authority. No one is watching out for our future.
Tom, enough of the smoke and mirrors. You know, and I know, the EPA is who ultimately determines what will be burned at the incinerator for as long as the incinerator is operating. And for those who don't know, changing a license with the EPA isn't as simple as calling them up and saying "Hey, we decided we are going to start burning plastic." It just doesn't work that way at all. Tom has asked questions and received very specific answers but he never brings those up on his onlines rants. He sugar coats and twist things to his likings.
TOM "THE ROACH","HAIRY" GARY MCALL AND "MEAN" DEAN MORGAN IN A TRIPLE DEATH MATCH ON MONDAY NIGHT RAW.....THE ONE THAT EMERGES AS VICTOR FACES DANE "THE TRAIN" BISHOP FOR THE BARNESVILLE HEAVYWEIGHT CHAMPION.
I've got my tighty whiteys and cowboy boots ready. Let's get it on. But Dane is already the proven champion of B'ville...I don't want any part of that fight.
I get tired sayiny Dane not fireman and dont drive firetruck never has never will so stop saying he does. He may be real to you not to me. I dont no Dane dont no any body no's him.Never seen Dane any where.Show me where can find him.
Ah...Papa Roach and his band of goons continue to stir the pot. The EPA issues license to any company that is in the business of releasing emissions into the air. This does not mean that they do not take input from the municipalities where they are located. So we are both right. The proof of this is the Cadillac, Michigan plant. Furthermore, more money will be spent in the next 5 to 10 years on alternative energy research than any time in the history of the world. Whose to say they won't find a new filtration system to burn other products with zero emission output. The previous sentence is the answer that Tom was given by the Pres of Rollcast when asked why he wouldn't sign an agreement to burn wood products only.
"Whose to say they won't find a new filtration system to burn other products with zero emission output."
This is not only pure speculation, it is scientifically impossible.
Converting one element to another through incineration renders it in another form(you cannot destroy matter) so there is no such animal possible as zero emissions.
When you burn you transform solid waste into gases and ashes both of which will contain harmful and toxic elements. By converting garbage "biomass" etc. we create 3 major new sources of toxic pollution... 1.Microfine fly ash that escapes the filters and lands in your lungs. 2.Organic gases that contain dioxins, furans, and volatile organic compounds by the ton-known carcinogens of the highest order. 3. Bottom ash laden with toxic metals that must by landfilled along with filters (unless they're washed and dumped in the sewer) and appear in the ground water table.. ................... One area of toxic ground water pollution was 1 mile wide and 8 miles long and will require 40 years of round the clock filtration to clean up by the EPA super Fund. ..................... Leaving the door open for this speculation is just an excuse to let the owners of the incinerator switch from wood to other biomass such as hazardous solid waste, medical waste, and garbage since these items fall under the classification umbrella of "biomass".
Whatever is burned winds up in the air, in the water, and in the soil. .................... One incinerator plant would not allow their employees to wear work clothes home because they were too toxic. These workers suffered swollen throats, skin eruptions, and other side effects in the plant. .................
132 comments:
Missy Kenderick came to a County Commission meeting and said the plant was restricted in what they burn. She also stated they would receive no local tax breaks.
At the IDA meeting in the public Q and A session , Rollcast Energy principal John Campbell was directly asked if they would sign something restricting what they burn and agree to not take local tax breaks.
He said no, they would not sign anything restricting what they burn or saying they would not take local tax breaks.
Even Kenny Roberts said they would "do whatever it takes" including tax incentives to make it happen.
We are slowly getting closer to the real truth. Getting the truth is like prying diamonds from rock.
Mayor Peter Banks now, as reported by the Herald-Gazette, says Rollcast is restricted by the EPD and would have to ask the EPD for a new burn permit. He also says Barnesville would have to give permission.
The only thing Banks is omitting is the final clause in the MOU he and Kenny signed.
On page 2 of the "Project Brown Memorandum of Understanding" in the middle of the page it says:
The Developer shall control the development of the Site and may change the Preliminary Master Plan from time to time in its SOLE discretion; provided that if Developer is desirous of developing the Site for anything other than a a non-fossil biomass fueled power facility and related improvements, Developer must first receive the written consent of the Officials, such CONSENT NOT TO BE UNREASONABLY CONDITIONED, WITHHELD or DELAYED."
What this means is Barnesville and the IDA signed an agreement that in common legal jargon says the plant can do anything they want and we cannot restrict or delay any change so long as they ask in advance in writing.
In essence Barnesville and the IDA has agreed to limit the operation to whatever the plant asks for, and whatever the EPD will permit. The EPD permits coal, tires, pressure treated wood, and other things.
What Barnesville and the IDA has done is sign another agreement that can get Lamar County or Barnesville into a long expensive legal battle over what happens in the future. We would have to go to court and argue what "reasonable" means.
If we put aside the fact Missy Kenderick told a "big tall tale" to Citizens and the Commissioners at the Commission meeting, and now focus on the slight increase in integrity by Peter Banks, we see the IDA is moving away from the original position but not quite bringing the issue into full sunlight.
The facts, and they are all in writing, are:
1. They can burn anything the EPD allows if they ask us first. We will not "unreasonably" try to delay or restrict any changes.
2. If 90 days before closing they ask for a 15 year bond lease back financing where the IDA owns (tax free) the land, equipment, and everything else the IDA will give it.
Unlike other deals the IDA has done, this thing will ALWAYS be a power plant. No one is going to spend 160 million dollars and then throw it away. Nearly all of the expense is in the burning, boilers and generating equipment. Very little or anything is usable for anything else.
If the IDA was smart, they would set a local cap on pollution levels and make sure the equipment (since that is most of the value) is taxed.
There is something else driving them to build this thing other than the 20 or so on site jobs it creates. Perhaps a share of that 160 million will filter into a local business, perhaps it is just feeling important.
They are bringing a plant that emits 20% or so less overall emissions than a coal plant into our community with a weak agreement that pretty much lets the plant burn what they want within EPD allowable limits.
The question is in trade for what? It certainly can't be the 20 jobs. If we fired Missy and disbanded the IDA we could create far more than 20 jobs with the savings.
A 'few' citizens?
Wait and see there Wally
WDM..... GIVE 'EM HELL!
Tom Rauch has found his calling in life!
I respected his views and ideals....then I saw him in that sweat-stained,musty t- shirt at the meeting...appearence wiped all that out.
I bet Bubba can tell you HA isn't a true blonde too.
12:37 PM if you base your opinion on that, then you are certainly wasted sperm.
Thank you Mr. Rauch for all that you are doing. Stay strong bro...they're coming.
It is fascinating to watch everyone work up in a lather about burning "fossil fuels" at this plant.
Barnesville is only 30 miles from the largest coal fired power plant in the world. Burns 40,000 tons every 24 hours and receives 5-6 trainloads of coal daily. Don't think I have ever smelled anything from Plant Scherer in all the years it has been there.
Oh well, I suppose the young people graduating from Gordon can always get a high paying job at Aldora...
Unlike Plant Scherer, Barnesville is not going to have a 1200 foot smoke stack and 4 cooling towers. Barnesville will not be using water from a clean lake for cooling. It will be using sewage water. Barnesville will not be getting fuel via rail. It will be trucked in via our roads. Perhaps you need to go back to Gordon for higher learning. I suggest potography or boating. It is evident that you don't get the picture and that you have totally missed the boat in regards to our green power plant.
I'd like to sign up for potography. Do they provide the rolling papers or do we bring our own?
Pawned again.
whats taking so long getting the vote totals in
did williams and harwick really get beat or is the vote counting still going on.....have the absentee ballots been counted ??
Hardwick is a gonner. One of barnesvilles strongest allies will soon be gone.
One sitting in the pokey, one on the way out. One or two more to go.
This power plant and the poor fire protection might just be the straw.
I didn't realize our fire protection was inferior.
Is that you Devane?
2009 Budget
We may have to have a recall on Mayor Banks or is he just that taken in or just plain stupid?
What do you think new fire station at Gordon College on Gordon Rd? Need two or three fire stations for the Barnesville Fire Department. And... ask the fire chief about how many firefighters working 24 hours? Did you ask the mayor about new fire station on Gordon Rd?
Odd thing I saw the other day.
When the King moved his left index finger the Mayor's mouth moved, yet there was no visual direct connection between the two.
Chris Angel needs to learn that trick.
"Unlike Plant Scherer, Barnesville is not going to have a 1200 foot smoke stack and 4 cooling towers. Barnesville will not be using water from a clean lake for cooling. It will be using sewage water. Barnesville will not be getting fuel via rail. It will be trucked in via our roads. Perhaps you need to go back to Gordon for higher learning. I suggest potography or boating. It is evident that you don't get the picture and that you have totally missed the boat in regards to our green power plant."
That was my point Mister Wizard.
Burning fossil fuels at the B'ville plant would require all the things you mention. All the hand wringing being done about this facility neatly overlooks the nonexistence of adequate water, and transport to supply this plant for fossil.
Never mind, it is much more fun for these CAVE (Citizens Against Virtually Everything...) dwellers to oppose any attempt to add something here. It's the Barnesville way.
"When the King moved his left index finger the Mayor's mouth moved, yet there was no visual direct connection between the two."
You're implying you were at the City Council Meeting Monday night.
Devane, stay off this BLOG!!! Your thoughts are not welcomed here.
Maybe it was Greg. He's always at the CCM's.
You folks don't know how a power plant works. Plant Scherer has a tall stack because of the volume of fuel it burns, not because it is coal.
It burns trainloads a day, so the stack has to be tall and wide.
This plant is likely only about 20% cleaner overall with wood than it would be with coal for the same 50MW output. The fancy guys from Atlanta are fooling you.
If the plant is really only going to burn clean waste wood and nothing else, they would sign a cap on pollution limits or a specific agreement giving limits on what they will burn.
Right now they refuse to do that, and you can bet if wood gets too expensive (it already costs more than coal) or if they want to make extra money burning waste, they will be able to do anything right up to what the EPD will allow with a new permit. The EPD will permit many things other than wood.
We have eight people led by the nose by two or three people that don't seem to understand what they are agreeing to.
If the plant really is going to be so clean and green forever, they wouldn't have a problem agreeing to a written emissions cap at the limit of what they told us they want to burn.
They are very smart, and they have dazzled a few people with big money and buzz words into an agreement that really doesn't protect us from anything in the future.
Once that thing gets built it will always be something that burns something to produce money. If it costs more to burn the fuel then they can make with sales of electricity, they aren't going to shut it off and go away. They will find something else to burn that somehow puts positive cash into the operation.
If they DON'T intend to burn anything with more emissions than the original clean wood permit, they certainly could put it in writing. If they did that and paid a reasonable local tax almost everyone would be happy.
As it is right now they promise to love, honor, and obey but they won't sign a good pre-nup. If they want to change their minds a day later or ten years later, we will be stuck with whatever the EPD allows.
It would be such a very simple thing to say "we agree to cap the emission limits at the intial permit limits for a no-tire fresh wood only plant" if that is what they really always intend.
Only a fool without any care for our future would sign a MOU like Kenny Roberts and Mayor banks did.
Look at the great wisdom Barnesville displayed on the new housing project, and the way the IDA misrepresented this project at the County Commission meeting.
Why should everyone trust them now, when the eventual cost might be another big expensive lawsuit we can't win?
An honorable man would never have any problem puting down in writing what he is promising verbally. And if the IDA was so honest, they never would have had a representative tell a big tall tale at the commission meeting.
That's absolutely right, Mr. Rauch.
Honorable men in this situation would NEVER have a problem with signing written agreements stating what they intend to do.
Like you, I have a problem with IDA reps coming to the commissioners and not being completely accurate with their reports.
The county commission should obtain an injunction against this project until the right people are prosecuted for malfeasence of duties.
True politician "extremely hard and thorough work"by the ida.
It sounds funny to me.
Usually if someone really knows what they are going to do they don't have a problem signing off in writing.
Why won't they sign an agreement of what they promise? Anyone know?
That's the same careful mayor that had two homestead exemptions, both requiring a sworn statement.
3:42 More ?What you mean?
Devane and Williams just stir that pot....that's all they know how to do! Rauch is in their pockets....
8:54 pm, HAVE YOU BEEN TOLD THAT YOU ARE A COWARD LATELY.
Anonymous? Your comments mean nothing. COWARD!
8:54 must have hit a nerve! Wow- what a reaction- tells me it's true...
I know why you are afraid to put your name. You don't want to have to explain the way you look and the ass whooping later.
I agree that a nerve must have been hit, all this talk about an ass whooping- somebody is mad about 8:54's comment, which tells most of us that it hit dead on target.
write in gene hardwick for sheriff of lamar co.....its the least we can do for him for his years of service to lamar county
hardwick has served his time in the county commision. he is all done working so hard for people who didnt appreciate him. let him enjoy his well deserved retirement. if he wants something on the side just to stay busy maybe someone has a opening he will fit into. heis a hard worker that can handle many positions but not the sheriff. please not that.
ok,,,,,how about tom rauch for write in candidate for sheriff
I don't know Ms Thrash. I hope she does a good job. But despite that, I can't help but feel Lamar County lost a sure good thing with Gene. He put in alot of hours working for the betterment of Lamar County and simultaneously put up with the like's of the Rauch's and McCall's. I know they feel vindicated but these two in all their name calling and public grandstanding have cost the people of Lamar County another good servant. So gmac and rauch congratulations on running off another good person for your the sake of stroking your own egos. I know you two must be proud.
Mr. Morgan,
For you to think that Tom or I were responsible for Commissioner Hardwick's loss is foolish. For starters we have no control over the voters. Next, all our voiced concerns were based on facts and not fiction. And finally, Commissioner Hardwick done this to himself. Actions on the BOC and IDA is what cost him the election.
Of course this is my opinion. And, my ego is not in any need of being stroked.
sounds like it must be the fault of everyone but the guy who got his butt kicked by a woman. course wdm is so smart he knows different.
instead of blaming others i'd be asking who is next or why did a he lose to someone he kept saying was worthless. if hardwick was right and thrash was worthless as he kept saying in his negative campaign then what does it make him to lose to such a worthless person? less than here, doesnt it?
I think he would have won if he wasnt so negative or full of himself.
McCall is right WDM.
Quit being a sore loser. This county has way too many sore losers.
If you want to blame anyone, blame the person who let a newcomer woman no one knows whip his two-term nose-in-everything butt.
Don't go away mad WDM, just go away.
One thing is for sure gmac you can definitely call out a sore loser since you appear to be one yourself. You have libeled and slandered this man's name for the past year on this blog anytime you got a chance. Just remember, you reap what you sow.
And gmac, even by your standards, I didn't think you were so weak you would have to validate your marked entry with a couple of anonymous blogs. That should tell everyone alot about you.
don't worry about wdm gary. he's just hurting right now because his buddy got beat fair and square. he's a sore loser like the other old boys who thought they had a lifetime job but lost. anyone can see how childish and spoiled he is.
still time to vote gene hardwick write in for sheriff........
Mr. Morgan,
Ad hominem attacks against others or me really just show how little you have to support Mr. Hardwick.
Mr. Hardwick lost by about a 20% margin. You may not like that, but this is America at its best. It is our system at work.
I didn't vote for or against Hardwick or Thrash, they were not in my district. I had no say in the matter.
Thrash didn't beat him, McCall didn't beat him, and I certainly didn't beat him.
The only way a long term elected offical is if most people who vote think the other candidate is a better choice.
Move on with your life and enjoy being a normal citizen with one vote. Stop blaming others for Gene's political shortfalls.
Next election, get your lazy rear off your golf cart and work for the person you support. Don't come around when it is too late with big teary eyes blaming others for your electile disfunction.
This "The only way a long term elected offical is if most people who vote think the other candidate is a better choice." should have said
"The only way a long term elected offical can be defeated is if most people who vote think the other candidate is a better choice."
you kids behave or i will turn this universe around right now.....GOD
the most common form of terrorism in the U>S> today is carried out by bulldozers, chain saws, and polluting power plants
Mr Rauch, you are a jackass and no matter who the county commissioners are that will never change. You don't know all you think you know. You defiled a good public servant without merit and it will all come back to haunt you someday (I know this for a fact.) I just hope that day is sooner rather than later.
wdm is missing his goat. anyone know who got it? ;-)
me thinks wdm is dilusional now and needs phyciactric help. he has gone over the rainbow.
i think it was the electile disfunction that hit home for him. :-)
speak your truth quietly, and listen to others, even the dull and ignorant,,,,,they too have their stories......and if you dont like their stories, they have others that you might like
right wingers who clamor for wars, and the death pently; and who oppose universal health care are not "pro-life" and should not say that they are for pro life
WDM,
Are you any kin to Buzzy Morgan, the well-driller who asked for and got a special variance which relieved him of the responsibility of having to run county water into his subdivision under construction on Steele Road?
Hardwick was one of the ringleaders in that fiasco which was approved in a secret meeting of the BOC in October 2005. Even commissioner Brown said on the record that the meeting hadnt been advertised and was the wrong thing to do.
If someone did that for me I'd sure like them too. That must have saved that person with your last name tens of thousands of dollars.
It didnt help anyone else though. Everyone else still has to pay to install water if their developments are within a certain distance of the available water.
Buzzy and Gene also helped out your (i mean his) sister when she got in a jam over a breached conservation property.
His sister was developing and selling lots in Milner on land that had been in conservation.
The BOA later found that since her husband had passed away she had received the benefit in error.
Im not for sure but it looks like the BOA let her slide on the underpayments since it was their 'mistake.'
Are you kni to these folks? NOT saying they've done ANYTHING wrong or otherwise; but if the commissioners helped me out like this when everyone else is struggling to pay their share of the load, well Id love them too.
WDM,
You sound like the jackalope
5:38 you already know the answer to that question. Most everybody does.
Damn those direct questions are a bitch!
I bet you won't get an answer to it.
How much you wanna bet they delete it?
I am not in the subdivision business so I can't answer your accusations. I don't know anything about conservation because I have never owned that much raw land. I do know that Tom Rauch and Gary McCall are two idiots who think they know alot more than they really do. But of course, I am sure alot of other people realize this as well.
get 'em, wd.
I prefer to live like a mushroom.
i trust the ida
5:38 or Roach or McCall, I do know for a fact that Buzzy Morgan had absolutely nothing to do with the Steele Road subdivision. Go look at the plat that was submitted to the planning and zoning office and you will find out for yourself. The fact is wdm appears to be right about one thing -- you don't know as much as you think you do. Just to show you how weak this Tom Roach and McCall are they are online beating up on an 80 year old woman because that is how old Buzzy's sister is. It takes a real macho man to do that.
Plat or no plat, Buzzy was the man who was going to be installing water wells instead of running county water.
By they way, his name isn't Roach and he didnt post 5:38 or any of the others today. So lay off Rauch and McCall.
personal attacks on private citizens will not be tolerated
9:02 PM and you are the little brown hole in the back keeping an eye out on them.
9:06 are you clueless. Roach and McCall are accusing Mr. Morgan of getting the county to run water lines to his subdivision (which turns out not to be his) for free...now if he was going to make money drilling wells, why would he have the county run the water??? It should just show us that Tom Roach and Gary McCall are stirring up stink on good local people like they did Hardwick. Roach and McCall are a cancer.
somebody pull out the can of Black Flag and let's fumigate some rauch's...and a mccall too!
If they keep talking about my family members, I am going to be the chemo that knocks them out. You hear me Roach and McCall.
Gary,
How do you know who WDM is?
What if he is not who you think he is?
Blogs can be a good thing, but they can be a bad thing too. They can be a good tool to debate facts. That all falls apart when people start getting personal. Then a blog is useless.
Let me give you an example. There isn't a single place on here where I said anything about WDM or his family. I said:
1.) Missy Kenderick misrepresented the agreement the IDA signed at the commission meeting. I can prove that.
2.) Mayor Banks is not telling the full story. He is moving closer to the truth now, but still omitting key facts. I can prove that.
Hardwick got dragged into this by someone, and then the whole issue diverged from the power plant. We all know the reason ANY politician loses is because the majority of voters just don't want the guy as much as they do someone running against him. End of discussion on Hardwick. He lost. It's over. Bye-bye.
A few people steered this away from the real issue, which is the power plant and the fact the IDA, after an initial public lie, is still telling people a partial story.
Arguing with WDM is exactly what they need. Everything said in personal attacks makes everyone else look bad, and takes attention away from the IDA's bad agreement.
The entire community could get stuck with a giant multi-million dollar lawsuit if they sign a weak agreement. We should focus on what is important and what we know as facts, not some past commissoner and his odd deals with friends. That chapter was closed by an election.
Let's focus on important things like getting the IDA to say they unequivocally support the community, rather than the power plant. It is the COMMUNITY Banks should be supporting, not the power plant.
Drop the silly stuff with WDM.
Why do folks on the losing end of an argument always resort to threats of violence?
People like wdm are just plain childish i guess
thats because they can't stand on facts, so they have to attack the person or call names
someone should try to defend the power plant instead of going after rauch and gmca.....bad mouthing people dont help prove your point..question is; do the majority of the people believe this is a good idea.....and the second question is do we trust the ida to make the important decisions that will effect this county for years.......if not, we need to bring pressure to change the makeup of the ida......need to have public information meetings to air our concerns and get the facts.....at a convience place and time and independent of the ida or commisioners
How is it that everyone else involved with the power plant is wrong and Tom is right? According to this one man, the mayor of B'vile is a liar, the IDA are liars, the county commission are liars? Has Mr. Rauch every thought that maybe he is wrong? Oh, wait a minute, there is no way he could be wrong...he thinks he is God.
Here is a fact for you to debate Mr. Roach, or can I just call you Papa Roach. The Mayor of B'ville says you are misrepresenting information? The IDA called out for misrepresenting information? Could it be that you are mispresenting information or are you calling all these people liars?
Tom Rauch I trust Mayor Banks on his record from the past. He is a solid as man as you will find in your life. His exact words are "unequivocal support" for the power plant and that the confusion is being created by the 'misinformation from a few." Do you think he meant you when he said a few?
9:02 comment is one of the best ever. Whoever thought of that deserves a pat on the back.
You can say anything you want about your "personal opinion", but I can prove everything I say either through documents or recordings.
Much of it is at this link:
http://www.barnesvillega.net/barnesville-lamar_ida.htm
I'll add sound recordings of Kenny Roberts and the fellow from the power plant, John Campbell, tonight.
The agreement Kenny Roberts and Peter banks signed contains a clause that clearly states the power plant can change what they burn or what they do any time they want. It says they have to get permission, but in Exhibit A it also says Barnesville and the IDA will not unreasonably condition, withold, or delay anything they ask for.
They can say what they like, but there is NOTHING in the agreement that restricts or limits what they burn and the power plant knows it.
The IDA also misled the public about incentives. Missy Kenderick stood in front of the County Commission and told the commission there would be no tax abatement. The document they signed includes an undefined open ended tax abatement of 15 years.
When I asked John Campbell, the plant principle at the IDA meeting, point blank if they would sign an agreement limiting what the plant can burn he said "I don't think that is necessary". I said "so the answer is no, you won't sign something limiting what you burn", and he indictated they would not sign anything.
When it came to abatements both Campbell and Roberts said if the plant required abatements they would get them. Kenny said he would do "whatever it takes" in the line of abatements to get the plant in here.
That's all on tape. It's all public record.
When I had a direct discussion with Campbell after the meeting, he said they might entertain some sort of pollution cap. He felt however that whatever the EDP limit was for emissions would be enough.
The "clean plant" they visited in Michigan is in an area with an "F" air quality rating. Yet the spin we hear is how clean the air was.
This entire project is a good example of how the IDA spins things to mislead the public. They are working for the plant, not for the community.
Another example of how the IDA spins things is the claim seven businesses announced their intention to locate and do business in Lamar. One of the businesses, Southern Textiles, never intended to hire anyone from lamar. They are leasing a storage and dock space at Carters for finished goods from China. The goods from China actually reduce jobs in the Forsyth area, and do not create any jobs here.
Another company already closed and left.
The track record of the IDA is actually not very good. The spin however, is excellent.
You'll notice they cannot refute anything I say. They can only attack the messanger. This is because they cannot argue against the truth.
Watch carefully. They can't argue against the facts, so they go after the messenger.
why dont we have the company president come to lamar county and meet the people and then we can ask him in person if he will ever burn other stuff......if he says he will burn other stuff, then we will mount an attack to keep him out.....if he says he wont burn other stuff, then does it anyway in the future.....we will take legal action
MR. ROACH IS ONLY TELLING HALF THE STORY HERE AS USUAL. WHAT HE ISN'T TELLING YOU IS THAT THE EPA SETS THE LIMIT TO WHAT CAN BE BURNED THROUGH ITS LICENSING AND THAT THE EPA'S POWER IN THIS SUPERCEDES ANY THING SIGNED OR AGREED UPON BY THE LOCAL ENTITIES INVOLVED. SO YES, IN THEORY HE MAY BE CORRECT THAT THE LOCAL AUTHORITIES CANNOT LIMIT WHAT THEY CAN BURN BECAUSE THAT IS HANDLED BY THE EPA ANYWAY. SO BASICALLY, IF THE LOCALS AND THE COMPANY SIGNED AN AGREEMENT LIMITING WHAT THEY CAN OR CANNOT BURN, IF THE DAY COMES THEY DID WANT TO CHANGE THAT, THE EPA WOULD MAKE THE FINAL DECISIONS ANYWAY NO MATTER WHAT WAS SIGNED NOW BETWEEN THE LOCALS AND THE COMPANY. SO BASICALLY, MR. ROACH IS STIRRING UP A HORNETS NEST WHEN IT IS THE EPA WHO ULTIMATELY DETERMINES WHAT WILL BE BURNED AT THE PLANT AND RIGHT NOW, THE PLANT IS LICENSED BY THE EPA TO BURNED WOOD WASTE PRODUCTS ONLY AND FOR THAT TO BE CHANGED, IT WOULD REQUIRE THE EPA TO AGREE. NOW, MR. ROACH, WOULD YOU PLEASE SHUT UP AND GO BACK IN THAT DARK CREVICE YOU CAME FROM.
If what the person with capital locks says is correct it looks like we are screwed if the plant comes in. If he is right then once the IDA invites them in and Bville signs a sales agreement, we are screwed. They can do anything they want that the EDP allows and we are stuck with it.
Why the hell would they invite in something like that, and why would they tell us they have limits if there aren't any?
It looks like the capitol lock post means that Rauch is really right and we have been hoodwinked by the IDA.
Of course you've been hoodwinked.
This project would, in my anonymous opinion, be a huge step backward for our community.
It's taken 200 years to get to where we are today. Why do we have to let a few egotistical people satisfy their desires for prestige by whoring out our environment and health?
I'll bet once the money's gone they will be too. Perhaps to St Simons.
Isnt St Simons where all of Barnesvilles rich and famous congregate to formulate their next plan?
Does anyone know when the next meeting is going to be held? I'd like to tell Scrot so he could crash the party.
MAYBE MR ROACH WOULD BE BETTER SERVED BY BRINGING ALL OF THESE ISSUES BEFORE THE TWO GOVERNING BODIES ULTIMATELY RESPONSIBLE FOR THESE SHENANIGHANS. THE CITY OF BARNESVILLE COUNCIL AND THE LAMAR COMMISSION. THATS WHO APPOINTS THESE FOLKS AND ENABLES THIS TYPE OF THING TO HAPPEN
dane vacations on St Simons....enough said
In preparation for the Olympics, China has announced a factory shutdown for 9 weeks to clear smog and improve air quality in a 200 kilometer radius of Beijing. The shutdown begins July 17th and will extend until September 20th. Beijing, Tianjin, Hebei, Shanxi, Inner Mongolia and Shandong provinces are affected by the shutdown.
If air quality does not improve before the start of the Olympics, there may be an expansion of the shutdown. There are concerns there could also be a bottleneck at two main ports.
The things about the power plant talked about by Tom Rauch are correct. The problem lies with the people that he is trying to communicate with. He raises good questions and he can in fact back up what he is saying with facts. Many people just want to disagree for reasons of disagreeing regardless of the facts. He has been to local meeting and voiced his complaint 12:47 PM. The answers are never direct. They are talk around answers or better known as dancing around the questions. He has already stated he is not against this plant but so many of you refused to hear that part. And 9:06 AM, he doesn't think he is God. He is someone that cares about the community he lives in, wanting honest representation. People should listen to what is being said rather than just hearing what is said. Then form educated opinions about the subject.
Poor Tom Rauch...you know you've hit the bottom with support when you've got Gary McCall publicly endorsing you.
Good reasons for the power plant. Lower bills on electrical service. Steady jobs for the community. Good use of wood waste products.
Tom Rauch is the right nut, Gary McCall is the left nut, and Devane is the scrotum that holds them together.
It must be difficult to to sign your names to such bold statements.
Oh wait; ya'll are all named anonymous. The substitute name for coward.
so far the only person i've seen that refutes rauch is a guy who made it look even worse for the people. he said we have no control at all over what they do. no one seems to be able to say anything but call names so i reckon rauch must be dead on or it is even worse than he thinks.
what gives two or three people the right to stick us with something like this.
4:29pm is the little brown dot in the middle
Tom I noticed you said the community could get stuck with a multi-million dollar lawsuit. Does that mean you are going to sue the county or the city? And if it does, I sure hope you do a better job with your lawsuit than your cohort gmac did with his.
Tom,
I agree with wdm.
I hope you do a much better job than I did because, I failed. I also hope that you will be supported by the people of the county in those efforts. Nothing will lead to failure quicker than a community that don't care one way or the other.
Tom,
If it was you - that ask how do I know @ 11:52.
We had a conversation last year about a subject and he told me who he was. In fact he gave me his whole name. I used a last name out of respect but I always knew who I'm talking with.
All the comments that followed were not by me. They were made by some of the blog idiots attempting to stir the pot. I pay them no attention. As far as wdm - he doesn't seem to try and hide his identity because I have always known him to post with his screen initials. We just don't agree on anything apparently.
As for the power plant - I understand your point and agree with you. Unfortunately, most people only look at it as a resistance to change. Once a group sacrifices trust and integrity, it's hard to get it back.
“The most dangerous man to any government is the man who is able to think things out… without regard to the prevailing superstitions and taboos. Almost inevitably he comes to the conclusion that the government he lives under is dishonest, insane, intolerable.” - H L Mencken
Gary,
WDM might indeed be who you say. He's just a little unimportant side show. Anyone with any brains can read back and see that.
The real issue is how eight people on the IDA plus the IDA Director were not able to look at this and understand the facts, or why they intentionally misrepresented the facts.
Another issue is why the Barnesville City Council didn't read the papers before voting.
Missy Kenderick stood in front of the County Commision and misrepresented the agreement they signed. That's all public record.
The Mayor of Barnesville discussed the sales agreement in a closed meeting, which is against sunshine laws. Those meetings are supposed to be public (purchases can be closed, sales cannot) so people affected by the changes can be involved in the process.
The only enforcement we will have is the EPD, and the EPD already told the Rock Quarry opponents they don't have the funds to monitor the air down here.
Why would people bring a power plant here that can only make money by burning things, that is not locally owned (so the profit and most of the investment money recycle leaves the area), that only creates 20-25 jobs, and that the only way we can control is with a big legal fight?
What person in his right mind brings a business like that, a business we can never make leave, into a community without telling the community the truth up front?
That plant is a for-profit business with NO local community ties. If that plant finds a cheaper fuel we are not allowed to UNREASONABLY stop or delay them from using it, no matter what it is. Eight people on the IDA plus a Director that can go somewhere else to work, and a few people on the City Council and a Mayor that moved here from some fancy place out east just to be the mayor won't pay the bills for laywers when this plant finds out it is more profitable to burn something else.
We will be stuck with a worthless agreement. The people we trusted will be long gone.
Why would they mislead the public? If the truth is good for us, why not tell it from the start? Those are the real questions that need answered.
Tom no offense but you are beating a dead horse with your silly antics. Your main supporter is gmac, a known pot stirrer & rebel rouser, and a couple of anonymous bloggers (who are probably gmac too.) Every local group's leader has gone on public record saying you are misrepresenting information. The only thing the general publlic knows about you is that you love to claim the local officials are doing them wrong (also known as rebel rousing.) You are like a school kid who isn't getting his way throwing a temper tantrum.
When this WDM character can't find anything wrong with what a person says then he attacks the person.
Kinda like the same thing Papa Roach does to the IDA, the mayor, and the commissioners. Roach can't be anyone of importance so he berates those who are. I love wdm's style. Give'em hell.
Rauch has facts. They are even published. What do you have besides a smart mouth?
wdm, with that comment you made at 10:04 AM, you must have been looking in a mirror at the same time. You described yourself to a tee. I have the opinion that you can't stand that someone else is right and you are wrong. You lose control and find fault with an individual. You live to disagree. Apparently you must think it sets you over and above those with whom you disagree. It doesn't. It only shows your inability to communicate and reason. If you had the ability to engage your brain the way you engage your mouth, you could solve all Lamar County problems along with the energy crisis. I can only assume that you are only capable of disagreeing for the sake of capturing the attention of people like yourself. If it offends you that some people actually care for the community they live in, why don't you get off your butt and brainstorm some new ideas yourself? Rather then argue with people with facts, why don’t you gather and use facts to counter your argument. Do you see how simpleminded your character assassinations appear? I don’t know why I even go to lengths to speak with you. With your uneducated attacks on people and subjects that should concern all the people of the county, you just aren't worth my time.
gmac, if you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen. You started the character assasinations on this blog over a year ago. Unless you come to the table with some real evidence, and not just your own personal interpretation, I will continue to assasinate your character like you and Tom have done to so many others. I find great humor in the fact you are trying to act like a victim now when you were the one who first started victimizing local people on this site. Remember the golden rule, do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
"you just aren't worth my time."
Just to keep the record straight, I've never said a word about the County Commission. You won't find a single negative comment here or anywhere else made by me about the Commission.
My beef with the IDA is their representative lied to or misled the commission, whatever word you care to use. That can be proven. She told the Commissioners there was an agreement banning tire and that there would be no local tax abatements, but there never was any binding agreement like that.
The MOU actually says, in writing, the opposite.
1.) It says the plant has control of the site. It says if they want to change fuels or the operation of the plant, they only have to ask in writing. Peter Banks and the IDA agreed to not unreasonably withhold or delay any changes they want to make.
2.) It says if they want a tax abatement with a 15 year term, they only need to ask 90 days before closing and the IDA will do its best to accomplish that.
No one who really honestly cares about our community would bring something into the county that will only for ever and ever be an incinerator that is intended to make a profit for investors by burning things without a clear agreement limiting what they do in the future.
No person looking out for the community would mislead or "spin" the information to make it look like we are protected when we are not.
These are the facts, and they are documented in printed materials and verified by audio recordings.
I'm not the one that made the IDA out to be a liar. The IDA did that to itself. They are an authority that is out of control because they have the wrong people on the authority. No one is watching out for our future.
Just to keep the record straight, I've never said a word about the County Commission. You won't find a single negative comment here or anywhere else made by me about the Commission.
My beef with the IDA is their representative lied to or misled the commission, whatever word you care to use. That can be proven. She told the Commissioners there was an agreement banning tire and that there would be no local tax abatements, but there never was any binding agreement like that.
The MOU actually says, in writing, the opposite.
1.) It says the plant has control of the site. It says if they want to change fuels or the operation of the plant, they only have to ask in writing. Peter Banks and the IDA agreed to not unreasonably withhold or delay any changes they want to make.
2.) It says if they want a tax abatement with a 15 year term, they only need to ask 90 days before closing and the IDA will do its best to accomplish that.
No one who really honestly cares about our community would bring something into the county that will only for ever and ever be an incinerator that is intended to make a profit for investors by burning things without a clear agreement limiting what they do in the future.
No person looking out for the community would mislead or "spin" the information to make it look like we are protected when we are not.
These are the facts, and they are documented in printed materials and verified by audio recordings.
I'm not the one that made the IDA out to be a liar. The IDA did that to itself. They are an authority that is out of control because they have the wrong people on the authority. No one is watching out for our future.
Tom, enough of the smoke and mirrors. You know, and I know, the EPA is who ultimately determines what will be burned at the incinerator for as long as the incinerator is operating. And for those who don't know, changing a license with the EPA isn't as simple as calling them up and saying "Hey, we decided we are going to start burning plastic." It just doesn't work that way at all. Tom has asked questions and received very specific answers but he never brings those up on his onlines rants. He sugar coats and twist things to his likings.
TOM "THE ROACH","HAIRY" GARY MCALL AND "MEAN" DEAN MORGAN IN A TRIPLE DEATH MATCH ON MONDAY NIGHT RAW.....THE ONE THAT EMERGES AS VICTOR FACES DANE "THE TRAIN" BISHOP FOR THE BARNESVILLE HEAVYWEIGHT CHAMPION.
I've got my tighty whiteys and cowboy boots ready. Let's get it on. But Dane is already the proven champion of B'ville...I don't want any part of that fight.
I would love to see you in those tighty whiteys and boots.Let me know when and where and I will be glad to wrestle with you.
JUST DONT HAVE ANY SKIDS IN THOSE TIGHTY WHITEYS,CAUSE OLE' ROACHES MIGHT BE CONSIDERING HOW HIS SHIRTS ARE.
They could wrestle at Dane's house. Dane can park the firetruck in his driveway and water them down with the hose and ref. the match.
I get tired sayiny Dane not fireman and dont drive firetruck never has never will so stop saying he does. He may be real to you not to me. I dont no Dane dont no any body no's him.Never seen Dane any where.Show me where can find him.
Now the IDA has taken to threatening people who ask questions. What a gang of misfits!
Must be about the money. Show me anger and physical threats and I'll show you the crooks.
Hey WDM. You seem to be arguing aganst the IDAots.
You say they can't control the power plant only the EPA can. The IDA and the mayor all say they can control the power plant.
Which one is true WDM? Are they bringing someone in they can't control like you say, or do they have control like Peter Banks is claiming?
Looks like either you or mayor Banks don't know what you are talking about. Which one of you is the dummy? Does the EPA control it or does the mayor?
Ah...Papa Roach and his band of goons continue to stir the pot. The EPA issues license to any company that is in the business of releasing emissions into the air. This does not mean that they do not take input from the municipalities where they are located. So we are both right. The proof of this is the Cadillac, Michigan plant. Furthermore, more money will be spent in the next 5 to 10 years on alternative energy research than any time in the history of the world. Whose to say they won't find a new filtration system to burn other products with zero emission output. The previous sentence is the answer that Tom was given by the Pres of Rollcast when asked why he wouldn't sign an agreement to burn wood products only.
"Papa Roach and the goons"....that's a good one, wdm... maybe they could take their show on the road....preferably far away from Lamar County
Chris...Friday 4 o'clock at the soccer fields. WDM
WDM I hear you used to break horses. I'm wild ,I want you to try to break me tomorrow.
fags
BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN US ANYDAY WDM!
Where were you wdm...I waited till 6 and you never showed up. Either you were scared or ashamed ,I'll see you at buggydays BIG BOY!!!!
Where were you wdm...I waited till 6 and you never showed up. Either you were scared or ashamed ,I'll see you at buggydays BIG BOY!!!!
The emissions from that stack are going to be 200-300 thousand tons of carbon dioxide plus limits of 249 tons of NOX and 249 tons of carbon monoxide.
http://www.barnesvillega.net/price_of_jobs.htm
What kind of dummies think that is good? Kenny and the IDA really screwed this one up.
http://www.barnesvillega.net/price_of_jobs.htm
Won't come out. Try this link:
http://www.barnesvillega.net and click on price of jobs link
In Response:
"Whose to say they won't find a new filtration system to burn other products with zero emission output."
This is not only pure speculation, it is scientifically impossible.
Converting one element to another through incineration renders it in another form(you cannot destroy matter) so there is no such animal possible as zero emissions.
When you burn you transform solid waste into gases and ashes both of which will contain harmful and toxic elements. By converting garbage "biomass" etc. we create 3 major new sources of toxic pollution...
1.Microfine fly ash that escapes the filters and lands in your lungs.
2.Organic gases that contain dioxins, furans, and volatile organic compounds by the ton-known carcinogens of the highest order.
3. Bottom ash laden with toxic metals that must by landfilled along with filters (unless they're washed and dumped in the sewer) and appear in the ground water table..
...................
One area of toxic ground water pollution was 1 mile wide and 8 miles long and will require 40 years of round the clock filtration to clean up by the EPA super Fund.
.....................
Leaving the door open for this speculation is just an excuse to let the owners of the incinerator switch from wood to other biomass such as hazardous solid waste, medical waste, and garbage since these items fall under the classification umbrella of "biomass".
Whatever is burned winds up in the air, in the water, and in the soil.
....................
One incinerator plant would not allow their employees to wear work clothes home because they were too toxic. These workers suffered swollen throats, skin eruptions, and other side effects in the plant.
.................
Further reading
http://www.marygrove.edu/ids/Detroit_Waste_Incinerator.asp
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